Elon Musk needs to be stopped.

[chokes999]

'Stop n Start' was a solution looking for a problem. City traffic, enter/exit highways in peak hour it was a small advantage as promoted by the marketing yobbos. Useless for most suburban, country & regional areas. Elon is just a marketing guru of a different type and his products will be judged by consumers. I think most marketing people belong in a padded cell where they can't insult my intelligence.

[alexora]

Originally Posted by ViceLikeEye

I don't know what start-stop technology has to do with Musk being a lying shitbag, but here's what I've heard. For auto manufacturers, stop-start tech is basically marketing nonsense to fool the consumer and to make themselves look like heroes, etc

Here in London, a great many of the 9,068 city buses have start/stop tech, and this has led (together with other measures) to a large reduction in emissions.

[ViceLikeEye]

Originally Posted by alexora

Here in London, a great many of the 9,068 city buses have start/stop tech, and this has led (together with other measures) to a large reduction in emissions.

Jeremy Clarkson might disagree. I'd love to link some funny vids, but I fear they might be seen as political. The crux of the vids are that buses are not even at full capacity and they are often completely empty (apart from the driver), pointlessly driving around spewing nasty shit into the air. And they take up valuable road space that could be used for cars and bicycles.

As mentioned by chokes999, stop-start is useless for a many people. The same could be said for modes of transport; Buses, trains. People that do not live in the US have a hard time wrapping their brains around how big the US is. My former Welsh friend who is a fan of Zippo lighters wanted to visit me and "nip down to the Zippo factory" from my place. I said, "dude, that's a minimum of an 8 hour drive just to get there". It's not a quick drive like it might be in the UK, more like 16 to 18+ hour round trip - not including touring the factory, getting fuel, rest and food, etc. I live on the east coast, I can leave my house and drive 3,000 miles (4,828 km) and still not see the Pacific ocean on California's coast. This country is vast.

Texas could store the United Kingdom's 93,410 square miles 2.8 times.

And that's just one state.

1. Alaska is equal to 7.05 UKs
2. Texas is equal to 2.86 UKs
3. California is equal to 1.74 UKs
4. Montana is equal to 1.56 UKs
5. New Mexico is equal to 1.29 UKs
6. Arizona is equal to 1.21 UKs
7. Nevada is equal to 1.17 UKs
8. Colorado is equal to 1.11 UKs
9. Oregon is equal to 1.04 UKs
10. Wyoming is equal to 1.03 UKs
11. Michigan is equal to 1.03 UKs

Plus the other 39 states...

Public transportation just isn't a thing here.

[mental]

The only time in my life i used a bus is when i was a kid, I used to ride the bus to the beach, knott's berry farm or disneyland almost every day when i was a kid but only until i started driving when i was 12.

[uglybob]

Knott's Berry Farm was great.

[Gwynd]

Taking London's 'New Routemaster' as an example, a UK bus holds 81 - 87 passengers, and does 10.84 UK MPG, so it doesn't need to be at anywhere near capacity to 'compensate' for the cars it removes from the road. I feel Jeremy Clarkson gets very few things 'right' as he's a reputation to keep up - his belief that catalytic converters were the 'right' solution to the 'wrong' problem in Europe was one, but he even got that idea from one of our former Prime Ministers.

And yes, we get the idea that the United States is vast - however, the United States only has one rail route in the top 20 longest in the world, so it's more than just the 'distance involved' that's the issue.

[alexora]

Originally Posted by ViceLikeEye

The crux of the vids are that buses are not even at full capacity and they are often completely empty (apart from the driver), pointlessly driving around spewing nasty shit into the air. And they take up valuable road space that could be used for cars and bicycles.

Not in London they're not: in 2019/20, 2.09 billion passenger journeys were made on London buses.

This is a typical scene for most Londoners, just imagine how much road space all those people would take up if each was riding in their own car, and what the emissions would be:

You Tube

You Tube

Originally Posted by mental

The only time in my life i used a bus is when i was a kid, I used to ride the bus to the beach, knott's berry farm or disneyland almost every day when i was a kid but only until i started driving when i was 12.

Those don't sound like typical city buses...

[mental]

Originally Posted by alexora

Those don't sound like typical city buses...

Buses run by the counties or state that went to certain places and made stops at a lot of places in different cities along the way there and back.

[alexora]

Originally Posted by mental

Buses run by the counties or state that went to certain places and made stops at a lot of places in different cities along the way there and back.

These would be what in the UK we call coaches.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coach_(bus)

You wouldn't see one of these on a route that includes stops in different cities and towns:

[ViceLikeEye]

Originally Posted by Gwynd

Taking London's 'New Routemaster' as an example, a UK bus holds 81 - 87 passengers, and does 10.84 UK MPG, so it doesn't need to be at anywhere near capacity to 'compensate' for the cars it removes from the road. I feel Jeremy Clarkson gets very few things 'right' as he's a reputation to keep up - his belief that catalytic converters were the 'right' solution to the 'wrong' problem in Europe was one, but he even got that idea from one of our former Prime Ministers.

And yes, we get the idea that the United States is vast - however, the United States only has one rail route in the top 20 longest in the world, so it's more than just the 'distance involved' that's the issue.

I'm not going to disagree. I view Clarkson as more of an entertainer rather than a journalist or a voice of reason. Many things he says and does are done for comedic effect; For instance, his stance on polar bears. I don't truly believe he means some of the things he's said. However, you can't exactly be besties with Greta (surname I won't mention) while guzzling fuel and shredding tires in high performance cars for a living.

That post (#33) was meant to be a bit comedic too, since we've gone off the rails (train pun intended) several times regarding the original topic of Musk being a snake oil salesperson/shitbag. So, if you can't beat'em, join'em.

Speaking of trains, yes it's more than a distance issue. For one thing, we're not spread evenly regarding population. New York city has almost 7.6 times the amount of people than in the whole state of Montana. Plus, American don't love public transport, so it's pretty difficult to justify spending billions or trillions for trains and tracks that may go unused. For better or worse, we love our cars.

Originally Posted by alexora

Not in London they're not: in 2019/20, 2.09 billion passenger journeys were made on London buses.

This is a typical scene for most Londoners, just imagine how much road space all those people would take up if each was riding in their own car, and what the emissions would be:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=4c-Qm6lRVJk

Those don't sound like typical city buses...

One of the vids I wanted to link (again, maybe too political) had Clarkson chatting with the UK's beloved Sir Terry Wogan (R.I.P.) and even he said he'd often see mostly or completely empty buses. The video looks old, probably recorded a couple decades ago. Clarkson looked much younger and Wogan was obviously still alive. Times probably have changed. Maybe owing a car has gotten too expensive in London, somewhat like it has in NYC. Maybe buses have become much more efficient and a better source of reliable transport. Again, I was just having some fun via Clarkson seeing as we were way off topic. A friend of mine told me, "He's Marmite, you either love him or hate him".

Originally Posted by mental

Buses run by the counties or state that went to certain places and made stops at a lot of places in different cities along the way there and back.

I was going to take a Greyhound bus once to Arizona - 2,600 miles. Then I found out it stops in every podunk town along the way. It probably would have taken over a week and a half (or more) to get to my destination, instead of driving myself which took about 4 days. I'm so glad I drove.