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Love Buzz · 6th June 2020, 14:50

Quite frankly I would rather see Omega beat him and take it from there. I'll look forward to his matches a lot more. They're acting like they need to make new stars but you got Omega fizzling out as the fourth wheel of the elite and nobody seems to give a crap. Cody has cooled down for me immensely. I know they have a story planned out that got halted cos of covid but they need those tag belts dropped cos it's shitting on the weekly product. It's like I'm aware that they're still trying to finish the old stories but can't because I know that team was meant to be makeshift. They gonna wait til 2021 to do the war games? You can't expect a large audience to show up for it in 2020, a lot will still be skeptical of going to places with large crowds so what the fuck are they doing.

Lance and Brodie are losers already, why should I care about Cage, he's just beating jobbers, like somehow that's impressive. I feel like if Cage loses he'll join them in the discarded wtf are we doing bunch. Are they gonna form a stable too? I can't figure out what the hell they are doing lately, feels like it's starting to break apart slightly and more WWE-esque.

Lonewolf · 7th June 2020, 00:42

Maybe it's just me, but IMO, AEW is trying to establish new stars just a little too soon.

Obviously, their first champions had to be name guys... names the casual fan know, then use them to give undercard guys the rub and elevate them. But it appears to me like they're trying to push the new guys too soon, and not allow the public to become invested in the characters.

Also, the storytelling is getting a little too WWE-ish... to me, New Japan is the template for how storylines should be: simple, and make sense. AEW is trying to be this homogenized hybrid of ROH & NXT, where storylines almost take a back seat to spotfests. And don't even get me started on Matt Hardy... I HATE the fucking character and all the shit that goes along with it... maybe it's the Cornette in me, but it ain't wrestling.

Also, it doesn't help that wrestling without fans is about as exciting as game shows without fans. Obviously, these companies are beholden to ad revenue, so they have to keep the product going, but it's boring, in my view. Every episode comes off as a rerun of the infamous "Secrets of Pro Wrestling Exposed" special aired on TV years ago. Crowd reaction is essential for televised wrestling to work. Otherwise, it comes off as cable access programming with really good production values.

They ought to do what the Korean Baseball League is doing (I just saw a couple games on ESPN2 recently)... instead of fans, they put stuffed dolls in the seats. Really. And it's funny as hell.... and a cool take on things.

Love Buzz · 7th June 2020, 12:38

They are getting ahead of themselves, no doubts. They haven't even properly established Page yet. He was getting there and then covid ruined the story.

Moxley is flopping lately. That promo with Taz felt weak to me, he was struggling. I've lost my hype for Moxley as champ and I couldn't really care to see him vs Cage. I don't buy the Taz hype. Heck they build Cage and then he ain't even on PPV, Brodie and Lance had their failures on PPV. The has-been boxer is probably the next PPV. What a load of bollocks. He was a bystander at the last one and they had commentary carny viewers into thinking he'd get involved and he didn't. He yawned ffs. Brodie and his goons should have went over and punked him out.

Fast tracking big guys like Cage, Lance, Brodie is the most WWE thing ever. It's like WWE because AEW are now making all the decisions selfishly. It's like ignoring the crowd, albeit different cos they aren't there, but it's essentially the same. WWE ignored the crowd for years and still do and now AEW got no crowd so they make selfish decisions and listen to Meltzer like somehow he's elected the voice of the people.

That's why they're fast tracking Jungle Boy because Meltzer was whinging about it on his shows. He's definitely involved even if it's just a bit. Who has ever really got over big in there very early 20s? Anybody ever? Maybe a Von Erich but they were a unit not an individual.

As for Hardy, that's personal taste. I get he almost makes it a comedy whenever he shows up but I don't mind it. Perhaps I'll get sick of him before long.

Lonewolf · 7th June 2020, 17:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Love Buzz

Fast tracking big guys like Cage, Lance, Brodie is the most WWE thing ever. It's like WWE because AEW are now making all the decisions selfishly. It's like ignoring the crowd, albeit different cos they aren't there, but it's essentially the same. WWE ignored the crowd for years and still do and now AEW got no crowd so they make selfish decisions and listen to Meltzer like somehow he's elected the voice of the people.

It's a McMahon mentality... only huge, jacked up guys can draw money. In the case of AEW, they should follow what Jim Cornette preaches... take someone who the audience is predisposed to like, and take someone who the audience is predisposed to dislike. You build them up, give them wins, then you bring them together and have them fight for something... money, titles, women, whatever.

Sounds simplified, but makes perfect sense when you think about it. It's all about suspending one's disbelief. If you buy into and mentally invest in what you're seeing, you're more likely to follow the product.

Love Buzz · 8th June 2020, 14:06

How is anyone supposed to honestly suspend disbelief when you got imposing guys like Cage, Archer and Lee. That's the whole point of weight classes but they exist whenever they feel like it. The current crop took what they found awe-inspiring when they were younger which is the WCW cruiserweight division, made that the norm, expanded on it exponentially and lost most of the logic. It doesn't blend with the heavyweights, yet they do it anyway and force them to conform to this cruiserweight style to fit in instead of being traditional big guys. The only ones they've hired are the ones that can do it.

Strowman was more of a real traditional big guy evolution when he was going loco a few years ago and mostly everybody thought it was great. I don't think we're getting true variety in matches anymore. It's all become about the match type to make it variety. This match will be different because of this element rather than the wrestler. Moves wise it's all very similar no matter what weight class and gender. I don't mean to hark on and I don't know if I've explained it very well but you can see why folks like Cornette get annoyed if you start to analyze it more from their perspective. Just not a lot in the biz look at it from his perspective so he gets crap albeit he doesn't exactly help with the way he portrays himself sometimes. I think I understand it more now but it does sort of ruin the viewing experience and I don't wanna stop watching so I don't know. I still enjoy it just not all of it.

Lonewolf · 19th June 2020, 22:37

Did I miss something, or is June 19th now National Accuse Wrestling Personalities of Sexual Abuse Day?

(I'm not making fun of it, but for these to all be made public in such a short span is curious. Many of these allegations have come to light as a result of a recent Twitter movement, #SpeakingUp. It should also be noted that as of the time of this post, no allegations have been proven, though some of the allegations are being corroborated by other wrestlers and/or employees of wrestling promotions, past and present.)

Those accused since June 17th of sexual abuse, their affiliation, and action taken if applicable:

AEW
===
Jimmy Havoc (suspended)
Sammy Guevara (suspended)

Impact
=====
Michael Elgin (released?)
Joey Ryan (released)
Dave Crist (released)

WWE
====
Matt Riddle - Raw
Jack Gallagher - 205 Live (released)

NXT
===
Velveteen Dream - NXT
Jordan Devlin - NXT UK; PROGRESS (suspended)
Travis Banks - NXT UK (released); PROGRESS (released)
El Ligero - NXT UK (released); PROGRESS UK (released)
Joe Coffey - NXT UK (suspended)
Pete Dunne - NXT UK
Big E. (not the New Day member) - NXT UK
Wolfgang - NXT UK
Joe Allen -NXT UK referee (released)

ROH
===
Marty Scurll

PROGRESS
========
Marc Parry - referee (released)
Scottie Davis (suspended)

CHIKARA - closed 6/24/2020, see below)
======
Kobald (released)
Icarus
Mike Quackenbush - Owner of CHIKARA - shut down promotion

Miscellaneous / Indy
===============
David Starr - several indies - released from OTT, TNT Extreme, RevPro; and PROGRESS
Jim & Stacey Cornette - part-owner/booker & talent/manager respectively - OVW
Dave Lagana - Executive VP of NWA (resigned)
Jeff Duncan - ECCW co-owner/booker (fired)
Andy Dalton - Inspire Pro Wrestling (released)
Mark Adam Haggerty - MLW announcer (released)

HoHoinc · 19th June 2020, 23:54

Yeah I love my Twitter, but after the slew of what was unleashed on my Timeline with all of that I wanted to delete it. Pretty crazy day and I hope the victims get justice if all the reports are true.

Love Buzz · 20th June 2020, 13:03

This is a fucking joke. The 80s were fucking insane, add every wrestler from that era to the list. You got grandpa Flair strutting around back there, he has admitted he has stories he can't tell, I fucking wonder why. They may have made mistakes and now they're lives are partially ruined because of it and everyone on Twattland is lapping it up and have got a fucking combined troll boner from all the ratting. Troll field day on Twattland and the dirt shit sites are swimming in bullshit slander cash and I'm sure they're journalistic integrity is by no means tainted by reporting things somebody said without proof. Bottom line is we'll never know if any of the stories are true but let's slander anyway and fuck people over for perceived mistakes publicly.

They fired Enzo immediately for something similar that he's been cleared of. So why is Riddle still there? So he won't go to AEW? But release Gallagher cos he's a jobber. Politics again everybody. We take this stuff very seriously they say... Sure ya do WWE.

The Cornette's are on there lol. For what? Slapping OVW wannabe wrestlers around for being idiots and not taking it seriously? It's called motivation. Was that Santino ratting on them or something.

MasterBates · 20th June 2020, 13:20

^ HA! Told ya old space mountain was on more coke in the 80s/90s than Scarface
Say hello to my little friend!

Love Buzz · 20th June 2020, 13:38

I guess I fell into the finger wagging scenario but he's said he has shit he can't tell during podcasts so I'm not full of it. I guess he paid them off after and got lucky they never ratted, although if you look hard enough you'd probably find something lurking somewhere. The internet is a big place. Anyway that's what these lot forgot to do. Whoopsie, here have $5000.

7th June 2020, 00:42	#132
Lonewolf Martha!!! Postaholic Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 6,983 Thanks: 4,283 Thanked 26,074 Times in 5,562 Posts	Maybe it's just me, but IMO, AEW is trying to establish new stars just a little too soon. Obviously, their first champions had to be name guys... names the casual fan know, then use them to give undercard guys the rub and elevate them. But it appears to me like they're trying to push the new guys too soon, and not allow the public to become invested in the characters. Also, the storytelling is getting a little too WWE-ish... to me, New Japan is the template for how storylines should be: simple, and make sense. AEW is trying to be this homogenized hybrid of ROH & NXT, where storylines almost take a back seat to spotfests. And don't even get me started on Matt Hardy... I HATE the fucking character and all the shit that goes along with it... maybe it's the Cornette in me, but it ain't wrestling. Also, it doesn't help that wrestling without fans is about as exciting as game shows without fans. Obviously, these companies are beholden to ad revenue, so they have to keep the product going, but it's boring, in my view. Every episode comes off as a rerun of the infamous "Secrets of Pro Wrestling Exposed" special aired on TV years ago. Crowd reaction is essential for televised wrestling to work. Otherwise, it comes off as cable access programming with really good production values. They ought to do what the Korean Baseball League is doing (I just saw a couple games on ESPN2 recently)... instead of fans, they put stuffed dolls in the seats. Really. And it's funny as hell.... and a cool take on things. __________________ (signature expertly crafted by cylnz)

19th June 2020, 22:37	#136
Lonewolf Martha!!! Postaholic Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 6,983 Thanks: 4,283 Thanked 26,074 Times in 5,562 Posts	Did I miss something, or is June 19th now National Accuse Wrestling Personalities of Sexual Abuse Day? (I'm not making fun of it, but for these to all be made public in such a short span is curious. Many of these allegations have come to light as a result of a recent Twitter movement, #SpeakingUp. It should also be noted that as of the time of this post, no allegations have been proven, though some of the allegations are being corroborated by other wrestlers and/or employees of wrestling promotions, past and present.) Those accused since June 17th of sexual abuse, their affiliation, and action taken if applicable: AEW === Jimmy Havoc (suspended) Sammy Guevara (suspended) Impact ===== Michael Elgin (released?) Joey Ryan (released) Dave Crist (released) WWE ==== Matt Riddle - Raw Jack Gallagher - 205 Live (released) NXT === Velveteen Dream - NXT Jordan Devlin - NXT UK; PROGRESS (suspended) Travis Banks - NXT UK (released); PROGRESS (released) El Ligero - NXT UK (released); PROGRESS UK (released) Joe Coffey - NXT UK (suspended) Pete Dunne - NXT UK Big E. (not the New Day member) - NXT UK Wolfgang - NXT UK Joe Allen -NXT UK referee (released) ROH === Marty Scurll PROGRESS ======== Marc Parry - referee (released) Scottie Davis (suspended) CHIKARA - closed 6/24/2020, see below) ====== Kobald (released) Icarus Mike Quackenbush - Owner of CHIKARA - shut down promotion Miscellaneous / Indy =============== David Starr - several indies - released from OTT, TNT Extreme, RevPro; and PROGRESS Jim & Stacey Cornette - part-owner/booker & talent/manager respectively - OVW Dave Lagana - Executive VP of NWA (resigned) Jeff Duncan - ECCW co-owner/booker (fired) Andy Dalton - Inspire Pro Wrestling (released) Mark Adam Haggerty - MLW announcer (released) __________________ (signature expertly crafted by cylnz) Last edited by Lonewolf; 30th June 2020 at 23:08. Reason: updated status of Coffey and added Joel Allen (both NXT UK)

20th June 2020, 13:20	#139
MasterBates We all need something to live for... Forum Lord Join Date: Jan 2019 Location: Greatness from Small Beginnings Posts: 1,195 Thanks: 345 Thanked 9,211 Times in 887 Posts	^ HA! Told ya old space mountain was on more coke in the 80s/90s than Scarface Say hello to my little friend! __________________

6th June 2020, 14:50	#131
Love Buzz Marginalised & Ostracised Clinically Insane Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 3,651 Thanks: 5,719 Thanked 13,008 Times in 2,758 Posts	Quite frankly I would rather see Omega beat him and take it from there. I'll look forward to his matches a lot more. They're acting like they need to make new stars but you got Omega fizzling out as the fourth wheel of the elite and nobody seems to give a crap. Cody has cooled down for me immensely. I know they have a story planned out that got halted cos of covid but they need those tag belts dropped cos it's shitting on the weekly product. It's like I'm aware that they're still trying to finish the old stories but can't because I know that team was meant to be makeshift. They gonna wait til 2021 to do the war games? You can't expect a large audience to show up for it in 2020, a lot will still be skeptical of going to places with large crowds so what the fuck are they doing. Lance and Brodie are losers already, why should I care about Cage, he's just beating jobbers, like somehow that's impressive. I feel like if Cage loses he'll join them in the discarded wtf are we doing bunch. Are they gonna form a stable too? I can't figure out what the hell they are doing lately, feels like it's starting to break apart slightly and more WWE-esque.

7th June 2020, 12:38	#133
Love Buzz Marginalised & Ostracised Clinically Insane Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 3,651 Thanks: 5,719 Thanked 13,008 Times in 2,758 Posts	They are getting ahead of themselves, no doubts. They haven't even properly established Page yet. He was getting there and then covid ruined the story. Moxley is flopping lately. That promo with Taz felt weak to me, he was struggling. I've lost my hype for Moxley as champ and I couldn't really care to see him vs Cage. I don't buy the Taz hype. Heck they build Cage and then he ain't even on PPV, Brodie and Lance had their failures on PPV. The has-been boxer is probably the next PPV. What a load of bollocks. He was a bystander at the last one and they had commentary carny viewers into thinking he'd get involved and he didn't. He yawned ffs. Brodie and his goons should have went over and punked him out. Fast tracking big guys like Cage, Lance, Brodie is the most WWE thing ever. It's like WWE because AEW are now making all the decisions selfishly. It's like ignoring the crowd, albeit different cos they aren't there, but it's essentially the same. WWE ignored the crowd for years and still do and now AEW got no crowd so they make selfish decisions and listen to Meltzer like somehow he's elected the voice of the people. That's why they're fast tracking Jungle Boy because Meltzer was whinging about it on his shows. He's definitely involved even if it's just a bit. Who has ever really got over big in there very early 20s? Anybody ever? Maybe a Von Erich but they were a unit not an individual. As for Hardy, that's personal taste. I get he almost makes it a comedy whenever he shows up but I don't mind it. Perhaps I'll get sick of him before long.

8th June 2020, 14:06	#135
Love Buzz Marginalised & Ostracised Clinically Insane Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 3,651 Thanks: 5,719 Thanked 13,008 Times in 2,758 Posts	How is anyone supposed to honestly suspend disbelief when you got imposing guys like Cage, Archer and Lee. That's the whole point of weight classes but they exist whenever they feel like it. The current crop took what they found awe-inspiring when they were younger which is the WCW cruiserweight division, made that the norm, expanded on it exponentially and lost most of the logic. It doesn't blend with the heavyweights, yet they do it anyway and force them to conform to this cruiserweight style to fit in instead of being traditional big guys. The only ones they've hired are the ones that can do it. Strowman was more of a real traditional big guy evolution when he was going loco a few years ago and mostly everybody thought it was great. I don't think we're getting true variety in matches anymore. It's all become about the match type to make it variety. This match will be different because of this element rather than the wrestler. Moves wise it's all very similar no matter what weight class and gender. I don't mean to hark on and I don't know if I've explained it very well but you can see why folks like Cornette get annoyed if you start to analyze it more from their perspective. Just not a lot in the biz look at it from his perspective so he gets crap albeit he doesn't exactly help with the way he portrays himself sometimes. I think I understand it more now but it does sort of ruin the viewing experience and I don't wanna stop watching so I don't know. I still enjoy it just not all of it.

19th June 2020, 23:54	#137
HoHoinc Registered User Addicted Join Date: Sep 2019 Location: Training with Ahsoka Posts: 172 Thanks: 894 Thanked 212 Times in 87 Posts	Yeah I love my Twitter, but after the slew of what was unleashed on my Timeline with all of that I wanted to delete it. Pretty crazy day and I hope the victims get justice if all the reports are true.

20th June 2020, 13:03	#138
Love Buzz Marginalised & Ostracised Clinically Insane Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 3,651 Thanks: 5,719 Thanked 13,008 Times in 2,758 Posts	This is a fucking joke. The 80s were fucking insane, add every wrestler from that era to the list. You got grandpa Flair strutting around back there, he has admitted he has stories he can't tell, I fucking wonder why. They may have made mistakes and now they're lives are partially ruined because of it and everyone on Twattland is lapping it up and have got a fucking combined troll boner from all the ratting. Troll field day on Twattland and the dirt shit sites are swimming in bullshit slander cash and I'm sure they're journalistic integrity is by no means tainted by reporting things somebody said without proof. Bottom line is we'll never know if any of the stories are true but let's slander anyway and fuck people over for perceived mistakes publicly. They fired Enzo immediately for something similar that he's been cleared of. So why is Riddle still there? So he won't go to AEW? But release Gallagher cos he's a jobber. Politics again everybody. We take this stuff very seriously they say... Sure ya do WWE. The Cornette's are on there lol. For what? Slapping OVW wannabe wrestlers around for being idiots and not taking it seriously? It's called motivation. Was that Santino ratting on them or something.

20th June 2020, 13:38	#140
Love Buzz Marginalised & Ostracised Clinically Insane Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 3,651 Thanks: 5,719 Thanked 13,008 Times in 2,758 Posts	I guess I fell into the finger wagging scenario but he's said he has shit he can't tell during podcasts so I'm not full of it. I guess he paid them off after and got lucky they never ratted, although if you look hard enough you'd probably find something lurking somewhere. The internet is a big place. Anyway that's what these lot forgot to do. Whoopsie, here have $5000.